[Discussion] Nation/Human relationships

[gisho.livejournal.com]

Hello to everyone! This is my first post here, and I'm sorry it's on such an inane topic, but it won't leave my head.

Which nations do you think have fallen in love with their bosses, or with other humans? There are three examples I can think of that seem to be pretty widely accepted in the fandom, and I'm curious if anyone else has headcanon on this, or can think of a plausible case.

First, it seems to be accepted fanon that when Elizabeth I Tudor claimed she would have no husband but her country, she meant it. Literally. *cough* Quite plausible - the Elizabethan era was a good one for England, and Elizabeth herself was deeply idolized. And England, at that point in time, would have been a dashing young pirate. However, it seems this is more a background assumption than something that gets actively explored in fics.

There are actual fics that posit Russia was one of Catherine the Great's lovers. Understandable on historical terms - despite her Prussian origins, she worked hard to become as Russian as possible, and her reign was good for the empire in terms of both terretorial expansion and cultural development (although not so good for the peasants).

Prussia and Frederick II have some stunning fanart and a number of fics. Very plausible both historically and purely from Hetalia canon - IIRC, there have been strips where Prussia talked about hwo great "Old Fritz" was, although I can't find the links. Historically, well, he expanded the country significantly and pushed through a lot of modernizing reforms. And he might well have been queer. *cough*

I'm sure there are other cases that could plausibly be ficced about. (For example, I've somehow convinced myself that Poland seduced King Stanislaw August in an attempt to get him away from Catherine II's influence.) Any ideas from the fandom at large? Or fic recs?

Comments

[din-84.livejournal.com]

I support the three fanon options you presented as well, other I can think of that have some fanon following are Maria Theresa of Austria and well Austria of course.

She was the only female ruler of the Habsburg dominions and the last of the House of Habsburg.
She also had this hate/respect (Seven Years War) relationship with Frederick II of Prussia which leads to some INTERESTING thoughts.

Even today she is probably the most beloved person of Habsburg dynasty in Austria.
She loved her country and people above all others and gave Austria a time of pride and brilliance despite major conflicts in foreign affairs.

Another couple I can think of but have never heard of in fanon terms is Hungary and Elisabeth of Bavaria, later Empress of Austria and Queen of Hungary and Bohemia (yes YURI)

The girl was in love not only with the Hungarian language but also with the Hungarian people.

Elisabeth loved Hungary far more than Austria and surrounded herself with Hungarian ladies-in-waiting;(!!!) she was particularly close to Marie Festetics and Ida Ferenczy.

She insisted that her attendants speak Hungarian, which she spoke fluently.
One of her closest friends was Count Andrássy, who later became Emperor Franz-Joseph's Foreign Minister. Elisabeth's attachment to Hungary benefitted the Empire because it encouraged the support of the Hungarian people, but at the same time, she alienated the Viennese and the Czechs of Bohemia. Several sites in Hungary are named after her: two of Budapest's districts, Erzsébetváros and Pesterzsébet; and Elisabeth Bridge.

Another relationship I would like to see written about more often is the complicated relationship of Germany and Hitler during the time of the second world war.

There's this Doujinshi about the UK and the US out there set during America's war of independence when suddenly there exist 2 America's. One that is on the side of England and one that fights for independence.
Seen from the viewpoint that the "country" is a personified version of the people's will this would make a lot of sense.

So coming back to WW2 there must have been a split of Germany very early on into the war imho.
Since the Germans of that time did not only consist of those who desperately longed for the promises of the NSDAP and were hoping for more work and food but also also of all the German Jews, proffesors, literates and normal people who didn't want to go to war or tried to stop it before 1945.

There's this one picture on pixiv with two Ludwigs where one kills the other at the end of the war which I find very symbolic, considering the road Germany took after the war until today.

OK ANWAYS LONG ASS COMMENT IS LONG AND THE SECOND HALF HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THE ACTUAL TOPIC ALALALA.

Oh yeah and also this:

I've somehow convinced myself that Poland seduced King Stanislaw August in an attempt to get him away from Catherine II's influence

is a very good idea >3

[yaoi-queen.livejournal.com]

"So coming back to WW2 there must have been a split of Germany very early on into the war imho.
Since the Germans of that time did not only consist of those who desperately longed for the promises of the NSDAP and were hoping for more work and food but also also of all the German Jews, proffesors, literates and normal people who didn't want to go to war or tried to stop it before 1945.

There's this one picture on pixiv with two Ludwigs where one kills the other at the end of the war which I find very symbolic, considering the road Germany took after the war until today."

I like what you said here, especially the last part. Germany would have had to split into two because of the separation of the wills of his people. Though in my headcanon, he's conflicted. He doesn't wanna disobey his boss, but he also knows right from wrong.

Btw, do you happen to have the pixiv picture of him stabbing himself? I'd love to have it.

[boscaresque.livejournal.com]

Oh man. I ship Elizabeth/England like there's no tomorrow. In my headcanon, she's the only woman he ever loved, and most likely it was one of the most healthy relationships he ever had. (Well, there was Boudica, but he was probably too young to remember much of her.)

I don't ship France/Joan of Arc. Not in a sexual way, at least, which I think actually says something pretty special about his relationship with her. I think that France loved Joan in a way that he never loved anyone else. Also, I think I wrote something vaguely France/Marie Antoinette at one point.

I can't help but think that Canada had/s a crush on Laura Secord.

America and the founding fathers were total bros. Totally platonic father-son type relationship. They'll always have a special place in his memory and when he gets fed up with things, he wishes they were still around. I'm absolutely convinced that he can see the ghosts of some of his most famous people and talk to them/ask for advice. (The only ghosts he doesn't seem to mind, lol.)

I am rather sick and twisted, so I kind of ship King Leopold/Belgium. Most likely one-sided, in a creepy 'old man crushing on the young hot girl' sort of way. Belgium hated him and his reign is one of her worst memories.

[maikichelorrain.livejournal.com]

Well... there's kinda a masculine equivalent for Jeanne in France (not totally copy-pasted but so many common points), so some active sect French fans consider Francis also felt in love with him.

[yaoi-queen.livejournal.com]

I've seen fanart of Russia/Anastasia that looked fairly nice. :)

Quite honestly, I don't really ship nations and mortals because of the pain it would cause them. I believe that every nation did, at one point in their younger naive years, fall for a mortal, only to learn the hard way that they die all to soon. Hence why (in my headcanon) nations never go beyond flirting with mortals. They know better now. I kinda got that idea in my head after seeing so many fanarts done of Francis's heart breaking after Jeanne of Arc's reign. I felt bad for him, so I use him as a perfect example of why nations should never get romantically involved with mortals, no matter how tempting it may be.

I'm such a hopeless romantic. ^^;

[xblkdragonx.livejournal.com]

;____; I think you just broke my heart with that image.... but I agree with you

[xblkdragonx.livejournal.com]

I know somebody posted a China/Mulan but I'm not sure if it was a romantic or platonic relationship

but dude, I totally wanna read the Catherine the Great fic now *go raids FFnet*

[inner-wings.livejournal.com]

I ship Russia/Catherine the Great like it's my job. *_* ....and then I tried to write fic for it, sob.

I was kind of sold after the story about her asking her doctor to take out all her German blood so that she would only have Russian blood in her veins. Come on, Russia would have melted over stuff like that! :D And for all her failings (especially with the peasants), she really did care about her country a great deal. She messed around with the guys a lot, but at the end of the day she always went back to Russia. *siiiigh*

I really love stuff about America and his founding fathers, though more in a platonic light. Ben Franklin was America's cool uncle who let him do science experiments and told him dirty jokes, you can't convince me otherwise. I ship America/Amelia Earhart too, just because the two of them flailing happily about airplanes is way too cute to pass by.

[kawa-hime.livejournal.com]

I DEMAND AMERICA/AMELIA EARHART NOW.
That'd be soooo sad.... She dissappears... D':

I WAAAAAAAAAANT. -adds to the list-

So I was just on the anon meme

[snogginnoggin.livejournal.com]

And what is it with you guys and Alfred/Lady Gaga? No, really.

I personally think France had a fling with Josephine Baker.

Re: So I was just on the anon meme

[snogginnoggin.livejournal.com]

A recurring, rather lusty fling.

[frauleingabor.livejournal.com]

I'm going to have to agree on the above point that Nations would probably avoid relationships with humans once they started getting older...

But, it is always fun to speculate, so...

My twisted headcanon tells me that RobespierrexFrance was so. During the National Assembly and the first part of the French Revolution, it's pretty obvious that he adored his nation. He was idealistic, he wanted to raise the masses... I can see France, once the Reign of Terror hits, being stuck in the relationship and feeding him ideas that make him more and more unpopular with the people until finally, they execute him. SO, a relationship that goes from "Yay! We love each other!" to "Shit, you're tearing me/my country apart, so I'm going to take you down through the guise of loving you".

Another pairing that my friend pointed out to me is Kronpriz Rudolf of Austria x Hungary, with it being mostly one-sided on Rudolf's part... He was the heir to the thrones of both Austria and Hngary (and Bohemia), due to the fact that it was, at the time, the Austro-Hungarian Empire, but there's evidence that he was pretty supportive of Hungarian nationalism, with anonymous liberal articles being attributed to him. Hungary was using him to gain her independence, and she half loved him, half hated him. (If my friend can ever get on the internet, she'll explain it much more eloquently than I. xD)

Lafayette x America. Lafayette was a French general who played a big role in the American Revolution, and Americans loved him. Really. They made him an honorary citizen, and when America came to France's aid during WWI, they did some in the name of Lafayette. Literally.

And... that's all I can think of.

[sara-rojo.livejournal.com]

My twisted headcanon tells me that RobespierrexFrance was so.

OMG YES PLIS Robespierre/France/Saint-Just OT3??

Lafayette x America

YES

[lai-choi-san.livejournal.com]

I know that Joan of Arc is more well-known but if you ask a French, the answer is this man :

(http://img15.imageshack.us/i/87876879moulinjpg.jpg/)

There are already FrancisxJean Moulin fics on hetalia_fr

[din-84.livejournal.com]

England/Anne Boleyn (later England/Elizabeth I)

I mean come on people not only was the the mother of Elizabeth I of England but also started the English Church Reformation.
Anne has been called "the most influential and important queen consort England has ever had," since she provided the occasion for Henry VIII to divorce Catherine of Aragon, and declare his independence from Rome.

The tragedie of her being executed but her daughther becoming eventually Queen of England after much struggle would make for an epic conflict heavy love story. Bloody too.
Do want.

[maikichelorrain.livejournal.com]

I don't specially ship Nations/ humans but it's always interesting to imagine the relations they could have...

So ... maybe some England/Victoria? It was one of his greatest queen after all, with Elizabeth. She even gave her name to the period, so I guess she alwo was important to him. He totally worshipped her.

(and Jean Moulin for France. Let's support the sexy men)

[openedlocket.livejournal.com]

Elizabeth marrying England? I agree. I made a fic about that which I haven't posted yet. I can actually see their relationship in that light, it could be the reason why England is so fond of Elizabeth I.

[sara-rojo.livejournal.com]

Bess/England brings out the best in him plus it's historical canon (her words, not mine)
He also got involved with some of his best known artists...definitely Oscar Wilde, and maybe Dickens and Shakespeare evenXD. And he had hot, delicious hatesex with William WallaceXD
He once had a crazy one-night stand with the Sex Pistols too
He had huge platonic love for Churchill and he has a mancrush on Obama that he will never admit toXD

Jeanne/France is so cute! ♥ But I prefer to imagine that, though he desired her, he nerver touched her to preserve her purity. He's never loved anyone like that after her death
And Robespierre/France/Saint-Just has just become my headcanon. FOR REAL
Also, he got pretty close and personal with most of his XIX century poets and some of his artists at the beginning of XX century

America has had multiple flings with many of his artists, most specially Elvis and Marilyn. He's had huge mancrushes on many of his presidents, specially the Founding Fathers, Teddy and the current guy. The platonic line was crossed just once, with Kennedy. He didn't have anything with the hippy guitarist musicians of Woodstock, but got crazy turned on with their solos. Nowadays, he'd hop into bed with Brad and Angelina if he had the chance, and fanboys RPS of Johnny Depp and Orlando Bloom (actors USUK?). He may or may not have shared a wild night with Iggy and the Beatles at one point

Russia/Catherine the Great, oh yes. I see his relationship with Anastasia more paternal, though.
He had A HUGE mancrush on both Lenin and Stalin. The second killing the first was actually what drove him over the edge.
Cracky headcanon says he likes to be ambiguous about his relationship with Putin to unsettle others. Putin plays along happily

Italy admired the Renaissance painters a great deal. He's had huge mancrushes on the Medicis even when he was a child. Berlusconi takes advantage of Romano's absence and gropes him sometimes LOL

Hungary/Sissi hot lesbian sex OH YESS
Make it a threesome with Austria and it's even better

Prussia has never been intimate with his bosses, but sports major mancrushes on them that don't go away even after they're dead. Fritz is his fav, but headcanon tells me that he went totally crazy for Bismark back in the day

Austria's relations with his citizens have always been platonical and full of polite, intellectual conversation and good musicXD

Finland may have comforted Simo Häyhä in a personal way; what a pair of badasses ^^

Spain was the Catholic Monarch's and Charles I friend; his involvement with Phillip is more ambiguous. He was totally excited with Alfonso X and probably bedded at least one muslim califa from Al-Andalus, but he also rode with El Cid from time to time (Y SO TURNCOAT SPAIN XDXDXD). He was BFF with Velazquez too. He totally completely adores King Juan Carlos and his family, and had the hugest mancrush on Felipe Gonzalez back in the 80's. He definitely slept with Sara Montiel, maybe with Hemingway, and is now totally in lust with Eduardo Noriega and Elsa Pataky. Nobody ever made him laugh like Dalí, but Quevedo came really close. He had the greatest crush on Ava Gardner at the time she lived in his land. Nowadays, he may have had a fling with Amenabar and sports crushes on his most famous sportsmen. I will shut up now about this guyXD

[materia-indigo.livejournal.com]

He didn't have anything with the hippy guitarist musicians of Woodstock, but got crazy turned on with their solos.

I can see him getting freaky with Jimi Hendrix, though, at least for a night. Jimi would've been able to see and recognize him. Hey, maybe Al was the inspiration for a certain famous Woodstock guitar solo. OK, that's my headcanon now. ^_^

[jinsai.livejournal.com]

I subscribe to the 'nations can't have PHYSICAL relationships with normal humans' school of fanon, but that certainly doesn't exclude them falling in love with them.

Besides those named, France was most certainly in love with Joan (in an utterly pure way). America's little boy crush was Pocahontas, but really, America is constantly falling in love. But it's his character to love all of them just as honestly and as passionately every time, and being in love with one doesn't mean he's any less in love with the others.

That said, he had a real thing for Lafayette, and France had one for Ben Franklin.

Japan had a geek crush on Thomas Edison.

[din-84.livejournal.com]

Japan had a geek crush on Thomas Edison.

I agree on this 100%

[din-84.livejournal.com]

Japan/Ryoma Sakamoto

It's so obvious!
No one embodies Japan's diremption between closing itself up and wanting to be part of the world more than him!

Ryōma was a visionary who envisioned a Japan without any feudal trappings. He read about and was inspired by the example of the United States where "all men are created equal." He realized that in order to compete with an industrially and technologically advanced outside world, the Japanese people must modernize to avoid being colonized or carved up into "spheres of influence" like China. He was also seen as an interesting anomaly in his preference for traditional samurai dress, while favoring western footwear.

god how did this turn into a tl;dr

[singing-monk.livejournal.com]

I'll admit, bad fan that I am, that historic people/country are my favorite type of pairing. I'm a sucker for that kind of thing.

That said.

I ship Jeanne/France and England/Elizabeth like everybody else. But I also think that England had one of those never said never acted on crushes on Shakespeare; being a country he'd probably have been able to see how fabulous his works really were and hung around the Globe like a sad little ghostie.

War of Austrian Succession strips and history have faithfully converted me to Maria Theresa/Austria. My dirty little bonus ship here is a foursome with Prussia and Old Fritz.

I totally believe that for America the Founding Fathers were like his loud, eccentric extended family. But I think that Lincoln is the person who he considers to be his only adoptive father (I mean, come on. The soldiers called him Father Abraham. And at one point Mary Todd said that she understood that he had to be 'a father to the country, not just to his sons')

Teddy was his bff forever and ever and ever. They went boxing together and jogged at ungodly hours around the national monuments. Also, no one will ever be able to dissuade me that every time Edison's lab blew its top it wasn't America coming to take a peek.

Egypt had a tiny boy in awe of an powerful woman!crush on Cleopatra, and I am endlessly amused at the idea of Romano and Michelangelo bitching each other out while he's painting the Sistine Chapel. Romano won't admit it, but he totally cried when the man died.

Spain was in love for all time with Isabella. He was secretly a little disappointed when she died before Ferdinand, and totally didn't think he gave her as much respect as she deserved.

And. France seduced Leonardo da Vinci when he was old and feeble, and both Italies have never really forgiven him for it. :|

Re: god how did this turn into a tl;dr

[sara-rojo.livejournal.com]

I am endlessly amused at the idea of Romano and Michelangelo bitching each other out while he's painting the Sistine Chapel

You have converted meXD

France seduced Leonardo da Vinci when he was old and feeble, and both Italies have never really forgiven him for it. :|

LOL

[verzerrung.livejournal.com]

Here's where I either get crucified, or people agree with me.

I think Canada had a thing for Pierre Trudeau. I mean. Do I even need to go into the Trudeaumania bit of Canadian history? He also did so much for Canada that I could easily see the poor boy developing this giant crush on him. 'Sides, during Trudeau's reign people actually started seeing Canada.

We all know that kid would worship him for THAT alone.

[sara-rojo.livejournal.com]

I heartily agree. I think he made Canada feel badassXD

[captainsway.livejournal.com]

In my headcannon, England had two loves: Elizabeth I and King Arthur.

Shut up, he was real! ; 3;

But seriously, even if he was legendary, King of the Britons and driving out the Saxons? Enough to make a nation swoon.

[sara-rojo.livejournal.com]

YES. I almost mentioned him, but since his existence is not really proven...nevertheless, Arthur's friends with pixies and gnomes, for god's sake. King Arthur existed in Hetalia FOR SURE

*insert pointless EnglandElizabeth rant here*

[heavensealed.livejournal.com]

Oh god, p-people need to stop talking about EnglandElizabeth or I will cease to be able to talk in comprehensive sentences. I love England. I love Her Majesty more. I just...can't even...at that shipping...

I really can't even. Words are totally failing me. Just the fact that it was mentioned had me fangasming all over the place. In my headcanon, she was his first love (among other things I've concluded and even act upon when I cosplay England. I'll write about them sometime). My England muse just...loves Her Majesty. Geez, my friends can tell you I love Her Majesty and I really just can't even, fffff.....

Pointless comment is pointless.

Re: *insert pointless EnglandElizabeth rant here*

[sara-rojo.livejournal.com]

you're so cute! you totally sound like my headcanon!Arthur whenever he adored Queen is mentionedXD

[ejsthespie.livejournal.com]

I think that England's attitudes toward most of his queens, whether regnant or consort, has been that of a mother figure, Bess excluded. His biggest influence in this regard was Eleanor of Aquitaine; I like to imagine that Eleanor is where England picked up his tsundere attitude. His favorite was probably Phillipa of Hainault. The only one of Henry VIII's wives he probably seduced was Katherine Parr. He and Charlotte were probably of mutual comfort to each other, Charlotte helping Arthur after Arthur lost Alfred and Arthur helping Charlotte as George III descended further into insanity. He's always regretted not having enough time for Victoria and has tried to make that up with the current queen.

There is no doubt in my mind that Francis seduced Richard the Lion-Heart, or it might have been the other way around (Arthur has never figured out which, but he knows he doesn't like it either way). Other than that, France has had sex with only two of his monarchs, Henri III and Louis XIII. He also had sex with Louis XIV's brother, but who didn't? Francis secretly hates DeGaulle to this day for the latter's ego. How dare anyone place himself above France?

Denmark had three-ways with Queen Maria Carolina and Johann von Streunsee. Maria's husband Christian VII might have tried to rape Denmark at one point, which explains the three-way thing. Denmark's other notable three-way came with Norway and King Haakon VII to formalize the transition from Prince Carl of Denmark to King Haakon of Norway.

I don't think Poland had sex with Stanislaus Augustus. The latter was too hung up on Catherine the Great. That didn't mean that Feliks didn't try, of course. The one Polish monarch he almost definitely had sex with was Augustus the Strong, with Saxony in the occasional three-way. Augustus would have sex with anyone, any time (the 360+ illegitimate children proves that).

Strangely enough, I don't think Ivan had sex with Catherine the Great. Anna and Elizabeth, yes, but not Catherine.

Ukraine has had sex with most of her Cossack grand hetmen as part of the accession ceremony, and she had a major crush on Potemkin. She's gone off sex a bit after the drunken pawings of Nikita Khrushchev, though.

Prussia after Old Fritz? He might have made some moves on a young Empress Augusta, and a young Wilhelm II might have made some moves on him, but that's about it. He's too awesome to engage in such frivolities.

[ejsthespie.livejournal.com]

Oh, yeah, forgot this one: Roderich and Joseph II. Total OTP material there.

[bonzai-bunny.livejournal.com]

While Alfred might have had bro-crushes on his founding fathers and a few other presidents (and Lafayette), it is my headcanon that Amelia Earhart was the first woman he loved. He still has hopes of finding her body one day.

That's all I can think of right now, a lot of other stuff has already been said by people.

[sara-rojo.livejournal.com]

Oh, god, YES. First human he bedded (maybe first man he loved), Laffayette. First woman he loved, Earhart. Headcanon updated

[sara-rojo.livejournal.com]

I just noticed I forgot about the Roman Empire...who, as we all know, was a dirty not-so-old man...and had as many flings and loves as increasing subjectsXD

Some of them: old kings of Rome whose name I can't recall, Marcus Emilius Scaurus, Gaius Marius, Sulla (of the batshit insane, drop-dead-gorgeous variety), Pompeius, Caesar, Octavius Augustus, Traianus, Cleopatra. He might have felt odd attraction for Cicero, and was BFF with Marcus AntoniusXD

And while Mother Egypt probably had hot lesbian sex with Cleopatra and got in bed with Ptolomeus, Mother Greece just doted adoringly on Alexander Magnus (I know he was Macedonian and not Greek...but uniting Greece is what made him legend). And she felt a mix of love and irritation toward LeonidasXD. She totally bedded Homer, thoughXD (and plobably Plato and a myriad of philosophers and stage writers...not Socrates, though; he was mean and uglyXD)

[kawa-hime.livejournal.com]

Alfred/Amelia Earhart
England/Elizabeth
France/Jeanne are my favorites.
Though I think America flirts with a bunch of girls... xD France is the only one who still has sexual relations with humans, but it's hardly intimate. One night stand stuff.

[ren-chan146.livejournal.com]

I'm rather new in this fandom so i never heard of this kind of pairing before. But i would really like to read something about them.
Especially about England and Elizabeth I (or any other Queen of his^^).
Can anybody suggest a good fanfiction about them?

fic!

[kisaragifan.livejournal.com]

http://ode-to-a.livejournal.com/5506.html

It's England with more interaction with Colonial!America, but his interaction with Bess here fills me with love. XD

Seriously, I bet England miss her the most... next to King Arthur, while he's at it.

[zumie-ashlen.livejournal.com]

Pfft I love this post and I have like a thousand new headcanons now.

But one that people have forgotten to mention:

Iggy has the biggest crush on JK Rowling.

Also America probably was BFF with the Wright brothers. You know it to be true.