hetalia | [Discussion] Nation/Human relationships

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[Discussion] Nation/Human relationships

Hello to everyone! This is my first post here, and I'm sorry it's on such an inane topic, but it won't leave my head.

Which nations do you think have fallen in love with their bosses, or with other humans? There are three examples I can think of that seem to be pretty widely accepted in the fandom, and I'm curious if anyone else has headcanon on this, or can think of a plausible case.

First, it seems to be accepted fanon that when Elizabeth I Tudor claimed she would have no husband but her country, she meant it. Literally. *cough* Quite plausible - the Elizabethan era was a good one for England, and Elizabeth herself was deeply idolized. And England, at that point in time, would have been a dashing young pirate. However, it seems this is more a background assumption than something that gets actively explored in fics.

There are actual fics that posit Russia was one of Catherine the Great's lovers. Understandable on historical terms - despite her Prussian origins, she worked hard to become as Russian as possible, and her reign was good for the empire in terms of both terretorial expansion and cultural development (although not so good for the peasants).

Prussia and Frederick II have some stunning fanart and a number of fics. Very plausible both historically and purely from Hetalia canon - IIRC, there have been strips where Prussia talked about hwo great "Old Fritz" was, although I can't find the links. Historically, well, he expanded the country significantly and pushed through a lot of modernizing reforms. And he might well have been queer. *cough*

I'm sure there are other cases that could plausibly be ficced about. (For example, I've somehow convinced myself that Poland seduced King Stanislaw August in an attempt to get him away from Catherine II's influence.) Any ideas from the fandom at large? Or fic recs?

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I support the three fanon options you presented as well, other I can think of that have some fanon following are Maria Theresa of Austria and well Austria of course.

She was the only female ruler of the Habsburg dominions and the last of the House of Habsburg.
She also had this hate/respect (Seven Years War) relationship with Frederick II of Prussia which leads to some INTERESTING thoughts.

Even today she is probably the most beloved person of Habsburg dynasty in Austria.
She loved her country and people above all others and gave Austria a time of pride and brilliance despite major conflicts in foreign affairs.

Another couple I can think of but have never heard of in fanon terms is Hungary and Elisabeth of Bavaria, later Empress of Austria and Queen of Hungary and Bohemia (yes YURI)

The girl was in love not only with the Hungarian language but also with the Hungarian people.

Elisabeth loved Hungary far more than Austria and surrounded herself with Hungarian ladies-in-waiting;(!!!) she was particularly close to Marie Festetics and Ida Ferenczy.

She insisted that her attendants speak Hungarian, which she spoke fluently.
One of her closest friends was Count Andrássy, who later became Emperor Franz-Joseph's Foreign Minister. Elisabeth's attachment to Hungary benefitted the Empire because it encouraged the support of the Hungarian people, but at the same time, she alienated the Viennese and the Czechs of Bohemia. Several sites in Hungary are named after her: two of Budapest's districts, Erzsébetváros and Pesterzsébet; and Elisabeth Bridge.

Another relationship I would like to see written about more often is the complicated relationship of Germany and Hitler during the time of the second world war.

There's this Doujinshi about the UK and the US out there set during America's war of independence when suddenly there exist 2 America's. One that is on the side of England and one that fights for independence.
Seen from the viewpoint that the "country" is a personified version of the people's will this would make a lot of sense.

So coming back to WW2 there must have been a split of Germany very early on into the war imho.
Since the Germans of that time did not only consist of those who desperately longed for the promises of the NSDAP and were hoping for more work and food but also also of all the German Jews, proffesors, literates and normal people who didn't want to go to war or tried to stop it before 1945.

There's this one picture on pixiv with two Ludwigs where one kills the other at the end of the war which I find very symbolic, considering the road Germany took after the war until today.

OK ANWAYS LONG ASS COMMENT IS LONG AND THE SECOND HALF HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THE ACTUAL TOPIC ALALALA.

Oh yeah and also this:

I've somehow convinced myself that Poland seduced King Stanislaw August in an attempt to get him away from Catherine II's influence

is a very good idea >3

Oh man. I ship Elizabeth/England like there's no tomorrow. In my headcanon, she's the only woman he ever loved, and most likely it was one of the most healthy relationships he ever had. (Well, there was Boudica, but he was probably too young to remember much of her.)

I don't ship France/Joan of Arc. Not in a sexual way, at least, which I think actually says something pretty special about his relationship with her. I think that France loved Joan in a way that he never loved anyone else. Also, I think I wrote something vaguely France/Marie Antoinette at one point.

I can't help but think that Canada had/s a crush on Laura Secord.

America and the founding fathers were total bros. Totally platonic father-son type relationship. They'll always have a special place in his memory and when he gets fed up with things, he wishes they were still around. I'm absolutely convinced that he can see the ghosts of some of his most famous people and talk to them/ask for advice. (The only ghosts he doesn't seem to mind, lol.)

I am rather sick and twisted, so I kind of ship King Leopold/Belgium. Most likely one-sided, in a creepy 'old man crushing on the young hot girl' sort of way. Belgium hated him and his reign is one of her worst memories.

"So coming back to WW2 there must have been a split of Germany very early on into the war imho.
Since the Germans of that time did not only consist of those who desperately longed for the promises of the NSDAP and were hoping for more work and food but also also of all the German Jews, proffesors, literates and normal people who didn't want to go to war or tried to stop it before 1945.

There's this one picture on pixiv with two Ludwigs where one kills the other at the end of the war which I find very symbolic, considering the road Germany took after the war until today."

I like what you said here, especially the last part. Germany would have had to split into two because of the separation of the wills of his people. Though in my headcanon, he's conflicted. He doesn't wanna disobey his boss, but he also knows right from wrong.

Btw, do you happen to have the pixiv picture of him stabbing himself? I'd love to have it.

I've seen fanart of Russia/Anastasia that looked fairly nice. :)

Quite honestly, I don't really ship nations and mortals because of the pain it would cause them. I believe that every nation did, at one point in their younger naive years, fall for a mortal, only to learn the hard way that they die all to soon. Hence why (in my headcanon) nations never go beyond flirting with mortals. They know better now. I kinda got that idea in my head after seeing so many fanarts done of Francis's heart breaking after Jeanne of Arc's reign. I felt bad for him, so I use him as a perfect example of why nations should never get romantically involved with mortals, no matter how tempting it may be.

I'm such a hopeless romantic. ^^;

I know somebody posted a China/Mulan but I'm not sure if it was a romantic or platonic relationship

but dude, I totally wanna read the Catherine the Great fic now *go raids FFnet*

;____; I think you just broke my heart with that image.... ~~but I agree with you~~

He doesn't wanna disobey his boss, but he also knows right from wrong.

I also thought about this a lot which brought me down to the genral question of .... if it comes to situations like war,situations where a government turns against his own people. On which side does the personified nation stand?

But in the end since a nation is born by its people must it not stand on the side of the people?
Argh this is really complicated especially since for example Prussia is not a nation born by its people but born out of the dream of only a few man who "created" its land.

Yayayaya.
Back to WW2, I think since the goverment itself was in disorder later in the war and many parts acted on themselves it wasn't clear anymore who the "boss" of Germany really was.
There were no elections anymore so was the boss still the "will of the people"?

As for the picture, I have it somewhere in my gigantic Hetalia folder give me a few mintues and I will post it ;)

;__; *mends it with happier thoughts* My heart breaks for all the nations who had to deal with such pain. -_-

I ship Russia/Catherine the Great like it's my job. *_* ....and then I tried to write fic for it, sob.

I was kind of sold after the story about her asking her doctor to take out all her German blood so that she would only have Russian blood in her veins. Come on, Russia would have melted over stuff like that! :D And for all her failings (especially with the peasants), she really did care about her country a great deal. She messed around with the guys a lot, but at the end of the day she always went back to Russia. *siiiigh*

I really love stuff about America and his founding fathers, though more in a platonic light. Ben Franklin was America's cool uncle who let him do science experiments and told him dirty jokes, you can't convince me otherwise. I ship America/Amelia Earhart too, just because the two of them flailing happily about airplanes is way too cute to pass by.

*nods* It's quite complicated indeed. But with Germany, there were two very distinct sides: the Nazis and everyone else. So, basically, the will of his people would be chaos and disorder. His people were Nazis as much as they were against them. So Ludwig was quite conflicted, even though Hitler was "the man in charge" and it's not Germany's place to disobey... or is it? I never understood that relationship between a nation and his boss. What position does the personified nation hold? It doesn't seem like they have a lot of say-so in matters regarding their countries.

But anyway, going off topic here. ^^;

So yeah... will of the people in Germany's case = ?, because there were two conflicting sides.

Thanks so much for finding it for me~! :D

There you go:

Thank you~! <3

Oh THAT picture! I have this one. I didn't know what it represented. I thought it was just kinky self-cest or something. XD; Now I like it more because of the symbolism. Thanks for sharing! :D

And what is it with you guys and Alfred/Lady Gaga? No, really.

I personally think France had a fling with Josephine Baker.

Yeah I read the Japanese explanatio and liked her way of thinking and explaining the picture and why she drew it, also thinking of Germany as splitting into two personalities until the end of the war would answer a lot of the questions we discussed above so I'm just gonna make it my headcanon.

A recurring, rather lusty fling.

Well... there's kinda a masculine equivalent for Jeanne in France (not totally copy-pasted but so many common points), so some ~~active sect~~ French fans consider Francis also felt in love with him.

I'm going to have to agree on the above point that Nations would probably avoid relationships with humans once they started getting older...

But, it is always fun to speculate, so...

My twisted headcanon tells me that RobespierrexFrance was so. During the National Assembly and the first part of the French Revolution, it's pretty obvious that he adored his nation. He was idealistic, he wanted to raise the masses... I can see France, once the Reign of Terror hits, being stuck in the relationship and feeding him ideas that make him more and more unpopular with the people until finally, they execute him. SO, a relationship that goes from "Yay! We love each other!" to "Shit, you're tearing me/my country apart, so I'm going to take you down through the guise of loving you".

Another pairing that my friend pointed out to me is Kronpriz Rudolf of Austria x Hungary, with it being mostly one-sided on Rudolf's part... He was the heir to the thrones of both Austria and Hngary (and Bohemia), due to the fact that it was, at the time, the Austro-Hungarian Empire, but there's evidence that he was pretty supportive of Hungarian nationalism, with anonymous liberal articles being attributed to him. Hungary was using him to gain her independence, and she half loved him, half hated him. (If my friend can ever get on the internet, she'll explain it much more eloquently than I. xD)

Lafayette x America. Lafayette was a French general who played a big role in the American Revolution, and Americans loved him. Really. They made him an honorary citizen, and when America came to France's aid during WWI, they did some in the name of Lafayette. Literally.

And... that's all I can think of.

Elisabeth x Hungary... YES.

She preferred Hungary so much to Austria, spending most of her time there without her husband. I wish I could articulate myself better, other than just, yeeees.

Have you ever listened to the musical Elisabeth?

OMG YAY I'M NOT THE ONLY ONE.
It's so OBVIOUS right?
NOW SOMEONE WRITE/DRAW US SOMETHING SEXY!

Of course I have ;3 in various languages and versions.
My best friend whom I have known now for 12 years is a big fan of "Sissi" and Habsburg era so if I wanted or not I got to know al the details ;)
It's not so bad though since I'm a history nerd myself.

I know that Joan of Arc is more well-known but if you ask a French, the answer is this man :

(http://img15.imageshack.us/i/87876879moulinjpg.jpg/)

There are already FrancisxJean Moulin fics on

hetalia_fr

Oh my goodness, my best friend is a huge fan of Sisi/Hapsburg, too. She researched the Mayerling Scandal for a paper last year, and came to the conclusion that Rudolf was murder by agents of Bismarck. I know what you mean.

(By the way, she says that she wants to meet your best friend. xD)

ZOMG YESSSS. If I could draw... It IS so obvious, though. Now we need to recruit people to our cause...

=D What's your favorite cast?

England/Anne Boleyn (later England/Elizabeth I)

I mean come on people not only was the the mother of Elizabeth I of England but also started the English Church Reformation.
Anne has been called "the most influential and important queen consort England has ever had," since she provided the occasion for Henry VIII to divorce Catherine of Aragon, and declare his independence from Rome.

The tragedie of her being executed but her daughther becoming eventually Queen of England after much struggle would make for an epic conflict heavy love story. Bloody too.
Do want.

OMG FOR REALS? Both of them could rant on for hours I bet, my friend just bought the German Spiegel Extra about the Habsburgs (ok I read it too >_>).

(if only that would be so easy, we two are living in Tokyo 8D We are Exil-Germans 8DDDD ladidaa)

We totally need to, maybe I will hit some keys on my keyboard tonight and write the first Hungary/Sissi fanfic ^^;.

Oh gawd, I haven't been into the whole musical scene for AGES, the last time I saw Elisabet was in ... errr... 2003 I think *fails*.
But I think my friend likes the original cast best, the one that played in Vienna.
I will go ask her when she's back.
I have the soundtrack on my iPod. >3

They probably could!

(Tokyo! That's so cool! Are you studying there?)

YES. Please do! My friend says "Squee!", and I shall wave around pom-poms that have the Hapsburg crest on them.

You say the Essen cast? -is insanely jealous- I haven't seen it live at all, I have no way to get to Germany (until June, but even then I won't be in the right Stadt D: ).

Baha, Kunze and Levay are brilliant.

What do you think of Der TodxPrussia? o.O

Yes I'm studying here, first I was in Canada to make my TOEIC and now I'm studying Japanese in Tokyo (psssht it's all because I don't want a bureau job >_> ).

I shall do that, I will ask if I can give out her email addy too ;)

Where are you from?
Oh man I would love to see musicals again, the last I saw was the "Tanz der Vampire" and I adore it to pieces it's so pretty and witty and gay <3
Also I wish they would play Les Miserables in more cities these days *sighs*

Der TodxPrussia? You mean like the Tod is in love with Prussia or like the Tod is Prussia because I can see both tbh.

;3

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[Discussion] Nation/Human relationships

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