[Question] Is HRE the Child form of Germany?

[kichiru.livejournal.com]

Hello again, all!
It is currently 50 degrees in the dead of winter. (OMGWTFBBQ?) Global warming FTW!

I have a question to ask that has been plaguing me for a while.

IS HOLY ROMAN EMPIRE...

...THE CHILD FORM OF GERMANY?

I want to know-- what you're thinking!  All these mad videos with a HRE uniform clad West(Germany) with Prussia are leading me to thinking of more weird character pairing ships so... Please help me out if you can!

 

-KICHIRU-
Please provide proof if available!

----------------

[UPDATE: 3/7/2009 @ 9:50pm est]

Upon rereading the Buon San Valentino Strip, and remembering Gilly had endearingly called Germany WEST, I realized that maybe I should Wiki it.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/West_Germany

Based off the coat of arms:


I'M A BELIEVER! <3

Also the flashback thingy...

Comments

[hakucho-cygnus.livejournal.com]

...Don't think so? I've read somewhere that the Holy Roman Empire dissolved around Napoleon's time (someone correct me on that) and I believe Germany was around at the time?

[rex-dart.livejournal.com]

That is, indeed, when the HRE formally stopped existing. Essentially, the Habsburgs simply lost the right to use the title of Holy Roman Emperor and that was what ended it.

[atiko.livejournal.com]

No, it really wasn't. "Germany" wasn't around till Prussia founded the German Empire in 1871. Napoleon dissolved HRE in 1806.
So if you say HRE =/= Germany, then Ludwig as a nation-tan would be just a little kid throughout WW1+2. (Aww?)

Finally, HRE's full title was "Holy Roman Empire of the German Nation", so... yeah.

[meltedpeep.livejournal.com]

*Ahem* The Holy Roman Empire dissolved around Napoleon's time because Napoleon was the one who dissolved it, or rather finally declared it defunct (it had been languishing for a couple of centuries). He established the Confederation of the Rhine as a protectorate of sorts from a good chunk of those territories, but that would get reorganized again after his defeat into another Confederation over which Austria and Prussia would fight for political supremacy. Prussia won out there in a war in 1866 and essentially elbowed Austria out of the picture, then went on to beat the snot out of France. So finally in 1871 we had the German Empire, comprised of much of what used to be the HRE + Prussia. So, hundreds of little states -> chaos -> ohmigosh empire -> more chaos -> modern Germany.

...Which is why Ludwig having amnesia makes perfect sense. But the more you know.

[sztori.livejournal.com]

THANK YOU FOR ASKING THIS.

I've been wanting to know as well!

[toriyalover.livejournal.com]

With all the Prussia videos I've been watching lately (oh Gilbert, I love you), I've started wondering the same thing. I would find myself pausing and wondering why HRE was with him, and then... realization that it's actually Germany o_o

.... It'd be nice for Italy, at least, right?

[sapphire-pyro.livejournal.com]

I would love to believe that (like many other fans), but as far as I know, there's no actual proof yet. The last page of the valentines strip hints that though, but not yet really shown for sure.

[drunensis.livejournal.com]

It's not confirmed but it's certainly hinted that way. The strongest proof is in the last chapter of the Buon San Valentino comics. (http://community.livejournal.com/hetalia/787290.html)

[ex-stephani638.livejournal.com]

He TOTALLY IS.

Like, Prussia picked him off the roadside after the Thirty Years War and was all, "Gentlemen, we can rebuild him. We have the technology. We have the capability to build the world's first bionic man German Empire. Ludwig Something will be that man. Better than he was before. Better, stronger, faster."

This is totally what happened.

But, from what I just found on wiki (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unification_of_Germany), read the "Holy Roman Empire" part.

[kichiru.livejournal.com]

I love you for this post. Let's make beautiful children together

Ah yeah, so I mean, you could say that Germany is technically HRE... but at the same time you could say PRUSSIA is also Germany... I wonder what route Hidekaz is going to take-- if he ever takes one.

[min19.livejournal.com]

There's no definite proof, but I'm a follower of the HRE=Germany theory. 8D

Just from a lot of little hints and not-so-little hints.
Like from the end of the valentine's day arc.

And also, some physical characteristics...
HRE has the same eye shape and same sideburns. XDDD
Germany could totally be a grown-up version of HRE, no?

And plus, with the whole HRE/Italy relationship, and now with the major hints at Germany/Italy canon...

Yeaahh. No proof/word from Himaruya yet, but I'm gonna say that HRE=Germany. :3

[kichiru.livejournal.com]

I have been linked to it, and I feel like a total dolt for asking, but what is this HUGE hint in the valentines comic? I am just not seeing it xD

[miharuno.livejournal.com]

Well the Germany the country was descended from the HRE, seeing how several countries (Italy etc) use to be part of that Empire.
It is probably true.

[kichiru.livejournal.com]

That's pretty much how I saw it but... then again, we can explain away a lot of things

EXAMPLE: America randomly appears in a forest...LOLWUT?

[lunahonou.livejournal.com]

May I just say that I am totally in love with your icon <33

[keikanas.livejournal.com]

it's a pretty often-assumed (and as you can see by theses comments, not without support or basis) theory. I like to believe it, at least. I think it would make a lot of sense... and look at HRE. He looks like a baby Ludwig!

[meltedpeep.livejournal.com]

Historically, geographically, and (in later centuries) culturally, the HRE is absolutely a precursor to modern Germany. Comic-wise, the hinting and evidence is so strong that I'm honestly a little surprised we keep having this discussion in fandom. Hidekaz could pull something unexpected out of his hat and shoot down all of this, as it's his storyline, but at this point I don't think he'd do that for any reason other than to screw around with fangirls, which isn't exactly how he rolls.

(In other news, I love that a manga boylove ship keeps making people try to decipher German history. Never stop being wacky, you guys.)

[atiko.livejournal.com]

You beat me to it again.

I love that a manga boylove ship keeps making people try to decipher German history.
Seconded. So much. xD

[atiko.livejournal.com]

remembering Gilly had endearingly called Germany WEST, I realized that maybe I should Wiki it.

Aughhh, as to why Gil is calling Germany "West"... I will never be able to wrap my brain around that. It makes NO SENSE because he does it even before the existence of/division between West and East Germany.
That coat of arms is still in use even in current Germany, btw. ;)

That being said, I believe HRE is really supposed to be little Germany. I'm trying to type down my reasoning for this but in the end it boils down to: how can he NOT be? xD My history classes about pre-20th century Germany were mediocre, but HRE has always been a part of the chain (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Germany) that it would just feel weird to me if it turned out he isn't.

[meltedpeep.livejournal.com]

Oh, cheer up! At least now we have reason to believe that Gil survives beyond 1947. Cue ill-advised Stasi uniform designs on Hidekaz's blog.

(Come to think of it, he doesn't seem at all bitter about the Preußenschlag in those new strips, does he? Maybe he's drunk.)

[1cheezymonkey.livejournal.com]

Totally off topic but, I kind of lol'd on the inside when you said "It is currently 50 degrees in the dead of winter. (OMGWTFBBQ?) Global warming FTW!" That would be like, pretty cold for where I am. =w=;

[harosketch.livejournal.com]

I lol'd at "50 degrees is cold for me". That's cold for you? WHERE are you...?

I'm in England and we'd be lucky to get 20 degrees at the moment.

[haineko123.livejournal.com]

wow thanks for the info ^_^
i knew HRE had something to do with Germany but i want 100% sure, well, now i know, thanks xD

This is the truth.

[fishlove.livejournal.com]

Once upon a time HRE was walking down he road. A gust of wind blew off his hat, but he had a bunch of wars to fight so he didn't notice.

The hat sat there. And sat there. And got rained on. And sat there.

Until one day tiny tendrils of hat material crawled into the ground and took root. For many years the hat was left incubating, but one morning, like a chicken bursting from an egg, Germany exploded out of the hat. Covered in yolk. Yolk that smelled like beer.

And thus Germany was born!

Re: This is the truth.

[annachuu.livejournal.com]

WHY DOES THIS MAKE SO MUCH SENSE OTL

[kasumicc.livejournal.com]

Since I'm a sort of newbie, I can't prove that HRE is Child!Germany (beyond the obvious fact that HRE indeed looks like a baby Ludwig). But I want to thank all of you for this topic <3 now I can be in peace being a believer ^^

[kyo-starr.livejournal.com]

That's the theory I subscribe to, anyway. History + canonical hints seem to point to it... Plus, Italy was in a similar situation as a developing nation: a mess of disunified political entities that eventually merged into a modern state. Chibitalia's accepted as the child form of Italy, so it would make sense of HRE is pre-unification Germany. ...Granted, the territorial shifts were a heck of a lot more chaotic for Germany, which would account for the amnesia.

I doubt Himaruya will ever explicitly state HRE IS GERMANY, and much as the fangirl in me would appreciate it I think I prefer it that way. The Valentine's strip was a pretty juicy intimation, and I kinda like the ambiguity.

[nanahashi.livejournal.com]

Therefore I thought HRE=Child Germany, but since I saw pic of HRE's adult form and the strip about France told adolescent N.Italy that HRE already gone, in Napoleonic war era i guess. I began to think HRE is maybe not Germany, since I believe that Germany should be at least, a toddler when Gilbo found him.

So, I think that HRE was really dead/abolished in 1805. IMO, Germany is his reincarnation and also descent HRE memory with him, but not exactly HRE.

Germany IS the Holy Roman Empire...

[cravingformercy.livejournal.com]

Remember that Hitler's Germany was the THIRD Reich

The FIRST Reich was the Holy Roman Empire

http://www.axishistory.com/index.php?id=4564

THERE 8DDDDDD YEY~!!!!

Re: Germany IS the Holy Roman Empire...

[aloafabread.livejournal.com]

8D

OH GOD


CONFIRMATION!

[miyu-mon.livejournal.com]

Yeah, I'm actually pretty sure that Germany is HRE.
It was also known as the "Holy Roman Empire of the German Nation". It just got smaller in therritory...
And Germany is a fan of the Roman Empire, so...
I'm wondering why Germany can't remember ;-;

[cravingformercy.livejournal.com]

Lol he is....Germany's First Reich was the Holy Roman Empire (Third Reich when under Hitler) soo....LOL

*SHOTxinfinity*

And Germany probably forgot because... after the Thirty Years War, the HRE was starting to dissolve..and around 1806 it was officially dissolved when Emperor Francis II renounced his title(I think) and after 1870 the Franco-Prussian (probably the reason how "Prussia picked him up"), that's when the Second Reich started... 8D

[lolishipper.livejournal.com]

im not sure about in real life, but in the flashback germany was having, it was from HRE's point of view, so...idk