hetalia | [Project] Perception of Foreigners in Japan through Hetalia

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[Project] Perception of Foreigners in Japan through Hetalia

Um, hello. I guess that I'm nervous, as this is the first post in this community that isn't me sharing fanfiction or a translation. If this isn't allowed, I'm really sorry; I read through the rules and thought it would be all right. If you'd rather get fanfiction from me, I have a post up here at help_japan auctioning drabbles off for a V-Gift each, but that's a bit beside the point.

Anyway! I managed to convince my professor to let me use Hetalia as the topic of my final paper for my Japanese Film and Society class. This is the last undergraduate essay that I have to write; I'll be starting at graduate school this fall. I really want to make this a strong essay and clearly argue the point that Hetalia is useful for analyzing Japanese views of Japan and other countries. I treat it as a self-aware, intentional use of Hetalia, and I'm not trying to argue that Hetalia is racist.

So why am I posting here?

In short, I'm coming up with a ton of examples, but the paper can only be so long. I want to choose the very best examples for the final paper, but I keep feeling as though there are things that I'm forgetting that would be better than what I already have. Therefore, I thought it would be worth asking the amazing community here for suggestions. The assignment is basically an anything goes kind of deal, so I can't offer many guidelines. If you'd like to see what I've already written and planned out, just ask, and I'll post it.

Also, if I have room I want to analyze the Hetalia fandom, so tropes that are prevalent in your own region would be lovely. But that's only if I have room. Also, I will naturally share the final paper with the community if there are interested parties!

tl;dr - If you'd like to help, please share the clearest examples you know of characters being portrayed as stereotypes. (eg, Japan being able to read the atmosphere while America can't, food and culture differences between Japan and other nations, Japan making mini U-Boats that transform, etc.)

EDIT: I promise that I'm reading all of your suggestions! Thank you SO MUCH to those who have contributed thus far! I'll reply to each of you individually when I can, but at the moment I'm frantically typing up the essay. I hope to have it mostly done by tonight, at which point I'll post it here and ask you all for final thoughts. If I can get it done by then. Again... Thank you so much for your contributions, everyone! I am listening!

EDIT EDIT: My essay is a hideous mess of outline and essay, but I have all the info I need to establish my points. I just need to put it in order, flesh it out, and then fix it up. I'm utterly exhausted at the moment, though, so that will have to wait until morning. Sorry. Once it's done, though, I'll be sure to post it. Thank you again for the assistance, everyone!

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The topic actually makes a lot of sense. As I recall, a lot of the America/Japan strips are based on Himaruya's experiences as a Japanese person in America, so in a way, it's sort of seeing the world through the eyes of a Japanese person, or at least in the case of America, seeing America through the eyes of a Japanese person. Basically, America seems to be how he sees American culture having seen it firsthand. (Looking at it from an American's perspective, he has a lot of American traits down pretty well!)

Edited 2011-05-08 02:25 (UTC)

The food thing, definitely. How, in every other country in the world, smalls are actually SMALL.

I don't know how relevant or helpful this will end up being, but if you read Scandinavia and the World on DeviantArt, you can get a Danish person's view on things.

I remember there was a joke I read in Kitayume's old archive (was it with the time back machine?) about three people standing in a desert island (two male and a girl) and what they would do by the perspective of England, Germany, France, Spain, Japan and Sweden. It was a very funny joke and Japan was the only one who gave out a very logical answer

Other than that well I think Japan's stereotype is pretty much:

-"I dont say my thoughts aloud"
-"I say that I'll think about your suggestions but the answer is no"
-Silent/little talk
-A person who is an otaku (a lot of otaku/anime culture)
-A person who works hard to not let down others
-A person who tries hard to adjust to other countries pase
-Sakura flowers and Samurai spirit
-Makes food made with raw fish
-Someone who is very kind to give a criticize
-Extremely good at technology
-Honor is very important for Japan
-The Emperor is a very noble that doesnt involve into scandals like in other monarchies/kingdoms
-Good at making miniatures.

From my personal experience:
-Twitter is more popular than facebook in Japan
-in American cartoons/movies Tokyo is a very futuristic city with robots(?) and technology is all over there.

I can't remember others right now

Edited 2011-05-08 03:03 (UTC)

Definitely a good point for looking at Japanese perceptions of Japan compared to America! All the "Japan-kun and America-kun" strips scattered throughout Vol. 2 would be good for that.

America's love for fast-food in general would be a good point.

These two scenes always stick out in my mind as being stereotypical:
- Japan taking a photo of America's crazy Blue Cake (middle of vol 2)
- Japan being petrified of Italy's driving style (World Series)

I'm also fond of England's love of esoteric things because those societies still exist (and are quite large too). Busby's chair (http://soapboxcorner.blogspot.com/2007/10/busby-stoop-curse-full-story.html) episodic just cracks me up and that Russia is more evil than it.

Not sure if these will help, but they are the ones that stick out in my mind (and I tend to make jokes about them).

Haha, I totally agree with you on the Twitter thing. Almost all the seiyuu that I like have a twitter and update FREQUENTLY. Facebook on the other hand...not so much.

And as a personal experience, my friends and I got a whole group of Japanese exchange students to make a facebook before they left our school to go back to Japan. Not a single one of them had one.

Since it's kinda my niche in the Hetalia fandom, the Japanese stereotype of Chinese people is a little different from the one we have in the United States. There is no blanket "Asian and Nerdy" stereotype, as far as I know, and the "illegal immigrant" image is stronger.

I do remember China being referred to as a great cook and being good at (gold-farming) MMORPG's (second Hetalia Fantasia drama CD). In his character CD it's mentioned "he makes the best food in the world". Yao's portrayal in Hetalia fandom is waaaaay better than the ugliest part of the stereotype, but he's a little...unrefined.

How about differing attitudes towards casual physical affection? Italy vs Japan is the clearest instance here, with Italy freely dispensing hugs and kisses, and Japan being clearly shocked by this behaviour (the "Take responsibility" strip).

I think the German and Italian stereotypes presented in Hetalia correspond pretty well with general European stereotypes about the people of those countries. Germans are efficient and by-the-book, while Italians are laid-back, flirtatious, and... rather hetare.

Hetalia fans I know from Nordic countries tend to be amused by how different Hetalia!Finland is from the usual Nordic stereotype of Finns (depressed, drunk, taciturn). I think Finland is chiefly known in Japan as a tourist destination for 'Santa Claus', though (Finnish Lapland gets a lot of Japanese tourists), so maybe that explains Finland's relatively cute/happy portrayal in the manga?

That sounds like a great topic for a paper! I'd certainly love to read it.

I always thought it's interesting how different the stereotypes used for Germany and Prussia are. The stereotypes other nations associate with Germany are the ones the Germans themselves associate most strongly with Prussia.

The most memorable stereotypical moment for me personally was Germany mashing his potatoes and being recognized by France due to this because at first I laughed, then I paused and realized, "wait, I do this, too!"

The stereotypes other nations associate with Germany are the ones the Germans themselves associate most strongly with Prussia.

IKR. But on the other hand, it's also Bavaria's image of "North Germans" in general (means: everyone except people from Baden-Württemberg and Bavaria) so I think there's a bit truth in it^^

Funnily, I don't mash my potatoes, though^^

I think the stereotype for Germans is the same all other nations have^^

Agreeing with artemis, in Germany those stereotypes are linked with Prussians (remember, Prussia was big and had nearly all of North Germany, but there was a big part of Germany that wasn't Prussian, too). And as I answered on artemis' post, it's also how Bavarians see "North Germans".

I think Himaruya himself said he made Prussia after a Prussian soldier - or Wilhelm II. I don't remember it exactly. Though I have to say, the "outgoing" nature would fit more to Wilhelm since he was a bit... extraordinary.

I had another idea of his character in my head: Gilbert symbolises a lot stereotypes West Germans have for East Germans. And it's a perfect contrast to Germany, who could be a personification of West Germans: While Gilbo is outgoing, quite open, loud and a bit... unproductive, Germany is always seen as hard working, but quite cold/unsure and a bit grumpy.

Negative stereotypes of America:

The obvious obsession with fast food. You know more Subways actually exist in America now, rather than McDonalds? America is constantly munching on burgers--not that I blame him. A good cheeseburger is an awesome thing. But he could at least be eating them from Five Guys Burger and Fries. McDonalds cheeseburgers suck.

America is obsessed with his weight. As much as people in other countries mock Americans for being fat--no one is a bigger critic of Americans, than other Americans.

America is mind-numbling stupid. This is the one that's most irritating and at first, I thought I was really going to hate him. Unfortunately, the fandom will also often portray him as incredibly dense.

Positive/Neutral Stereotypes:

America has a Big Heart: This is the one that made me love him, instead of hate him. He feels things so intensely and so deeply--he will sometimes make rash decisions and become very emotional.

I would say that as a general rule--Americans are like this. Just generally, remember. Americans are taught from first grade on to be determined, loud and proud. If at first you don't succeed--find whatever is holding you back and break it in half.

America tends to fake people out though, as well. Himaruya has hinted that America is smart enough to read the atmosphere, he just chooses not to--because it's usually quite sad. America grins and laughs and acts like he doesn't understand--but he has these moments--usually regarding England--where you start to see through some of that, where he has some real depth of character. Almost everyone judges him on his outside appearance.

America like color and flash: This is totally true. Those multicolored pastry concoctions in the bakery--epic and awesome. They do exist and they are wonderful.

America loves heroes. Again, totally true. We love heroes. Why do you think we have so many comic books? Now, the huge grand schemes he comes up with...eh.

But sometimes, when we've come up with those schemes, they've actually worked. You ever hear about how the Germans were thwarted during World War Two with giant inflatable tanks (http://www.theotherside.co.uk/tm-heritage/background/fortitudes.htm)?

In a country where, in the 19th/20th centuries, things like electric lights were being invented--America having this huge creative streak is kind of understandable. He did a lot of things that other people scoffed at and said was impossible.

Haha, oh yes! I hadn't even thought of the Bavarian view on the Germans farther north in that context.

Actually, I'm kinda hoping for Prussian-Bavarian bitching if we ever get a Bavaria strip.

But... but... when the potatoes are mashed, they soak up the sauce so nicely! XD

Me tooooo *_* It'd be so freaking epic *_*

I only mash my potatoes with spinach, that's tasty XD

Funny, I didn't think about the Prussian vs German stereotype until this post, which is ironic because I have two German colleagues, one is from Bavaria and the other from Niedersachsen and the two of them are constantly teasing each other. The Bavarian jests that they're so awesome they have a word that means both "hello" and "goodbye" (the word is "Servus", for those who are wondering), while the Northerner jokes that only shows they have a limited vocabulary. XDDD

Himaruya also makes fun of the ability to expand Yao has (Chinatowns all over the place)

Using the "large fries" episode and all of the Japan-kun and America-kun sketches in the anime. Thank you both!

Do you happen to have specific episodes I can cite for the fast food thing? Which episode was it where America was loudly slurping down a milkshake while talking at a meeting? It's totally relevant to the point I'm trying to make, but I just can't remember it...

Thank you very much for your list! Do you happen to have any specific episodes that bring up the otaku thing?

Both are very true. Unfortunately, I'm mostly talking about fandom, not social media usage in general. Even so, thank you for your input!

Thank you so much for your assistance!

Was that first one made into an episode? It's a film class, so I have to focus on the anime, but that's a really good point, and I'd love to be able to use it.

Also, which episode did they go driving in? I may be able to work that point in, but I need to be able to cite it, and I just can't recall it... Sorry!

Oooh, I love that about England, too, but if I talk about every character, I'm going to go over the page limit, and she's already said that she absolutely won't read anything past the twelfth page... Drat. Hmm.

Thank you so much for your input!

Ah, I see! Do you have any references like that in the anime? Since it's a film class, I have to primarily or exclusively use the anime, which is making all of this even harder...

Yeah, the stereotypes about China would be really great to work in... The problem is that I actually know next to nothing about stereotypes in the first place; that's part of why I'm so interested in the Japanese stereotypes shown in Hetalia. Like "aru". So, really, I thank you for your help.

Oh, brilliant point, thank you! I'll use that one. Too bad that I can't cite every single example of this; it's just so pervasive. I wonder why I didn't remember it...

Oh, thank you for your input!

I'm using the physical affection thing, thank you. The other information is really interesting, but I don't know what I can cite to verify it... I don't think I can just state it uncited, either. It's certainly interesting to know, though, thank you!

I'll share it with the community once I'm done with it all, and if you check back here later tonight, I'll probably have the entire essay posted. (And editing would be welcome, although I won't demand it of anyone.)

What, really? I had no idea! I wish I could include that information, but my essay is already getting to be longer than it ought to be, and I haven't even gotten around to incorporating my academic sources yet...

But that's really awesome to know, regardless. Thank you (and everyone in the thread) for sharing!

This is brilliant information, thank you! I just wish I had a proper citation so I could work it in. As it is, I'm sort of sticking with countries that I know personally for the moment. Thank you very much, though! I really appreciate you taking the time to post!

Your post is awesome. Just saying. Thank you so much! You really encapsulated a lot of the points I was trying to define in my own essay. I'll probably work in a fair bit of it in the end; since I'll probably be posting the essay itself to the community later tonight, you can see then what I incorporated.

Thank you again for your assistance!

I'd say the loudness stereotype is very extended in Japanese culture. Anyone foreign, even other Asians, tend to be louder than the Japanese characters in manganime. If you are American, you'll end up being twice as loud, much more than Latins(who in my experience are much louder irl).

Another thing is work. Japanese people work a lot of hours per day, and they believe Americans don't, so America seems to slack off and doesn't take his work seriously in the series, while Japan is always working or relaxing after a day of work. Himaruya portrays the Europeans as more hard-working than America, except the southern Europeans. Ironically, in the real world southern Europe makes many more work hours a day than Germans, for example, and Americans work more hours than both! But since japanese work more than anyone except South Koreans...

Speaking of, it'd be interesting if you explored the fascinatingly wrong portrayal of Korea in Hetalia.

Politeness too. Japan is the most polite of them all. The others interrupt each other, constantly talk about themselves, forget to say 'thank you' or 'sorry' (or never had any intention to say them in the first place).

Others:
-French as hairy naturists with a great love of enjoying life.
-Brits as perverts, drunkards and believers of magical things (lol). Rockers, pirates, gentlemen...~~England is the most accurate and deep/complete portrayal of his nation in this series~~
-Both countries as being very smug and proud. I think that is very accurate. And of course, the Anglo-French animosity! As is usual in popular culture, Himaruya shows us British victories and no French.

-America is very straightforward: loud, obnoxious, loves fast food, ~~selectively~~ oblivious, egocentric, like a child and enthusiastic. Adventurer, very curious, likes big spectacular bright-coloured things and being the center of attention by playing the hero. As always in Japanese works, Americans end up being extremely fair-haired/eyed.

Which could be an interesting topic, actually. More than 70% of the cast is different shades of blond with light eyes of different colours. Some of them extremely off with the country they represent (Italy as a redhead in the anime, America and Russia being so white and blonde, Norway and Finland being so small, all the green eyes around...). Japanese tend to portray non-Asian foreigners as blonde/blue eyed (maybe an ideal of foreign beauty?). In Hetalia's case, they are almost invariably bigger and stronger than Japan, even China. There needs to be a mention of penis sizes: in the strips penis jokes are exchanged between America and Russia, presumably very big, and Japan is told he is very small by Italy.
Also, there are barely any blacks (and none of them look like black people either), and no South Americans. There's barely any exploration of cultural shock between Christian/Muslim cultures, and tanned skin of all kinds tends to be washed over in the anime.

-Americans and Canadians are indistinguishable from the outside XD

-It could also be interesting if you wrote about which countries Himaruya decided to make male, and which women. There is no VERY powerful female country in Hetalia, and most of them are or were dependant on the male ones at some point. (scratch that: ALL OF THEM). The japanese identify the most powerful and influential nations as males, and usually buffness equals power: America is tall and fit and has crazy strength, Germany is insanely big and muscley, Russia is very tall and strong, China has superstrength... (I once heard the japanese thought their nation would be a man in his sixties, so perhaps you could work with that?).
If you want to contrast it with the way the japanese fandom portrays females, you have A LOT to talk about: Hungary's bastardization into a weeping maiden, or the way Belarus melts in America's arms. Also interesting is how the fandom changes characters when they change gender: the very strong (male) Russia becomes a helpless maiden as female in most j-fan works. And I've always found incredibly accurate that Himaruya wrote female Japan as yearning for America...as irl, japanese people are very obsessed with USA.

Thank you so much for your lengthy and in-depth reply! Don't worry about the order; my reply is in an even odder order. Whoops.

I would love to talk about many of the things you discussed (in particular the portrayal of South Korea), but many of the things you mentioned have yet to make it into the actual anime; as this is a film class, I feel like I have to focus almost entirely on the anime.

I do, however, address the general lack of non-white, non-Asian characters in Hetalia. Especially Seychelles's whiteness. Oh, that made me wince in the anime. Thank you for mentioning it, though, as I do believe that it's a very important point.

The work thing! Oh, man, I should have thought of it! You're entirely right. Can you think of any specific episodes that highlight this contrast? That would be the perfect addition to my section comparing Japan and America. I need to be able to cite specific episodes whenever possible, though...

The size and build point is also a really good thing to note. (I'm tiny, so I just generally group people into three categories: "Bigger than me" (95%), "only a little bigger than me" (4%), and "smaller than me" (1%). Not much of an exaggeration, either.) I never pay attention to character height, which can be problematic. Is there an official height/build chart I can turn to for this sort of thing?

Oh, believe me, I reeeeaaaaally want to address the lack of powerful female characters, but I really believe that the only reason Himaruya didn't depict any of them as female is because he wasn't confident about drawing girls until all of the main characters had been designed. Maybe that's just a rumor, though... Even so, I do contrast Cuba and Seychelles; Seychelles gets to be white with smooth hair because she has to be attractive for her role in the game. Meanwhile, Cuba is chubby, is the darkest character in the show (to my knowledge) and has dredlocks. He's portrayed as brash and violent (poor Canada!) and doesn't have to be attractive, etc.

...I should be writing my essay! Uh oh!

I'll talk when I'm done! Sorry, and thank you again!

I think that may be episode 9 of Axis Powers. In the manga, there's a strip where America's slurping on a drink and horking down a hamburger during a meeting (pg. 50-6 of Vol. 2), and at the end of the meeting, England goes off to talk to his magical friends, which I KNOW occurs in episode 11. Unfortunately, I don't own the anime and I can't find the episode online except to DL, but I think it's probably 9.

Were there any other fast food references you were looking for in the anime?

Hmmmm, it doesn't seem to be 9, although that is the the one where he starts saying that everyone's going to be his backup. It must be around there, though, so thank you for the hint! I'll track it down eventually...

Oh, I guess that I wasn't sure whether there were any other clear references to the fast food thing, aside from the Nihon-kun to Amerika-kun sketches and that one where he was, as you said, horking down burgers. Now that I'm looking at my essay, I think that those two may be sufficient, but if you know of any others, they'd be welcome!

Thank you again for your help!

If I had more than twelve pages, I might just try to work that in, but I don't... Thank you, though!

I hope you find it! It's rather difficult to search for... But it has to be in there somewhere. ~~It's just hiding, like a ninja.~~

Good luck with your paper! o7

not much episodes but strips:

http://aph.starry-sky.com/nkmng.html

the second and third strips

Ah, that's too bad. Since it's a film class, I really need to be focusing on episodes. I'd forgotten that there were so many strips that have yet to make it into the anime...

Thank you, though!

Thank you! My brain is totally shutting down for the summer, which is just no good at all, since I start grad school in June. Ah well.

I have basically all of the pieces that I need for my essay, and all of the quotes from my outside sources, but now it's time to put them all together and I'm running out of steam... I hope I can put it all together tonight so that I can post it for all of you before I go to sleep!

Thank you again for your help and well wishes!

aaaaaah! if it is a film class maybe you can show them this video?: http://youtu.be/8KLtxXNmcVc I know it's not official but it's one of the best hetalia fanmade videos out there and it's all about Japan so it works perfectly

Oh, I'm not showing anything. I'm just analyzing the series in an essay. Classes are done for the semester, and it's time for finals, so we aren't even going to meet as a class any more.

If I can fit in a section on fandom, though, it may come in handy, so thank you!

That's exactly what got me thinking about this, as a matter of fact! I studied abroad in Japan and it got me to thinking about views of foreigners and so forth, as well.

I'm almost there with my essay, but I'm just too tired to continue tonight... I'll post it tomorrow for sure, though!

No problem! I wish I could give you a real citation, it's just... something so natural in Germany^^

XD Bavarians tend to act like they don't want to have to do anything with North Germans at all^^ there even is an insult for them - "Saupreiß" (which means "Prussian swine(s)"). It's not always used in an offensive way though^^
And yes, they're also very very proud of their dialect XD (while it's funny that you mention it, because it's said that people from Niedersachsen speak the best/purest German of all^^)

it's said that people from Niedersachsen speak the best/purest German of all^^)

That's true! Even our Bavarian guy acknowledges that our person from Niedersachsen speaks the purest German. I guess it's kinda like how in the US "broadcast English" is English from the Midwest.

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[Project] Perception of Foreigners in Japan through Hetalia

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The order of this is so random, I apologize

Re: The order of this is so random, I apologize

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